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bmw88rider
bmw88rider GRM+ Memberand UberDork
8/19/22 12:08 p.m.

Nice. That will make for a good combo.  Be careful with the intake hose on those. I've ripped 2 old ones just because they get really brittle. 

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter)
Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
8/19/22 4:21 p.m.

Can't wait to put it through the ringer.  I checked.  My tetanus booster is current.

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/21/22 4:29 p.m.

Tiny update. 
 

Old coil pulled and new one installed. The old one fought a bit and I had to drill out the old screws holding the leads. Sanded off all the corrosion and gave the leads a good cleaning. 

Fired up and still misfiring horribly under load. 
At this point my parts cannon is out of ammo and I need to turn to actually diagnosing. More to come after the team meets this week to troubleshoot. 
 

On a positive note, the wheels and tires were delivered today

they're real, and they're spectacular. 
 

anyone have a known good distributor for a B18 laying around?

Slippery
Slippery GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
8/21/22 9:08 p.m.

Just for the hell of it, I would pop the valve cover and do a once over on the valve clearances. At least spin the motor and make sure they are all closing. 

Byrneon27
Byrneon27 GRM+ Memberand Reader
8/21/22 9:20 p.m.

I should have a non VTec distributor. Obd 1 or 2? 

eastsideTim
eastsideTim UltimaDork
8/21/22 9:51 p.m.
Byrneon27 said:

I should have a non VTec distributor. Obd 1 or 2? 

Should be obd1.

Slippery, good thought - I'm bringing a compression tester to the next work session, so that may give us an idea if any valves are too tight.  I'll grab a set of feeler gauges, too, just in case.

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/21/22 10:20 p.m.

In reply to Byrneon27 :

Tim is right, obd1. 

Curtis73 (Forum Supporter)
Curtis73 (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
8/22/22 3:55 p.m.

Might just be a good old fashioned coked-up injector.

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/22/22 9:07 p.m.

I'm not a smart man, but I value learning. 
While we did not find our culprit, today I learned. I can value that.
Gotta keep positive in life and in 28yr old Hondas. 

I also officially met Wae, who has some great toys. Didn't get the results we wanted, but progress. 
Its good to stay positive
 

Update on the diagnostics for the 4 of you following along: 
 

we first checked compression. 
155-145-145-140 good enough for now

 We checked plug wire resistance - 12-7k ohm. All within range 

we checked firing order - all correct (Haynes manual is majorly incorrect) which led us down a little detour. Turns out it COULD be misfiring worse. 

We hooked up Bill's scope and checked injectors. All seem to be opening properly 

 Then Bill checked ignition with the scope - signal is erratic, but not sure it's the issue. Not sure it isn't...

Tested charge voltage with an extra ground hooked up; 0.4V jump so there's some gain to be had. No change to misfire. Going to address that soon. 
 

So we have a few more suspects to investigate:

-fuel pressure- need to confirm, didn't get it checked today

-distributor- could be source of the erratic signal

- some other funky sensor like TPS? Crank sensor? 

 

On a positive note, Dave threw the new shoes on while we were scratching our heads

 

Captdownshift (Forum Supporter)
Captdownshift (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
8/22/22 9:11 p.m.

Lot of teggy parts on marketplace, in CT, NMNA https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/2864589047020821/?ref=facebook_story_share

 

I'll just leave this here...

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/22/22 9:17 p.m.

In reply to Captdownshift (Forum Supporter) :

Tempting but I'm in baby step mode. Need a distributor first 

wae
wae PowerDork
8/22/22 9:19 p.m.

To be fair the waveforms were more noisy than erratic.  The plugs looked like they were hitting on a regular schedule, but the crank signal and injector lines just had so much crap going on.

solfly
solfly Dork
8/22/22 9:21 p.m.

All the important sensors are in the distributor.

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/22/22 9:21 p.m.

In reply to wae :

This- 

I knew I'd misquote you lol

XLR99 (Forum Supporter)
XLR99 (Forum Supporter) Dork
8/22/22 9:31 p.m.

When I dragged home my Lazarus 98 Civic, one of the GRM Hondaphiles described the Brown Dust of Death inside the distributor cap.  Your car has it!

I just got a cheap complete plug and play dizzy/coil/cap off Amazon, but that was a few years back, so may no longer be challenge-budget-friendly

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/22/22 9:55 p.m.

In reply to XLR99 (Forum Supporter) :

Did it hold up? 
I hear the aftermarket ones hold up like British electronics 

XLR99 (Forum Supporter)
XLR99 (Forum Supporter) Dork
8/23/22 7:07 a.m.

I think I got about 40k out of it (?), so definitely not OEM durability.  Ended up throwing a spare in the trunk.  The failure mode I got was 'Runs Fine' -> 'Dead', there wasnt any misfiring action first though.

I also noticed the ground wire to the head is pretty green, could that be contributing?

Byrneon27
Byrneon27 GRM+ Memberand Reader
8/23/22 7:09 a.m.

Brown mess in the distributor is bad. I've had reasonable luck with eBay distributors over time. I'll run over to the shop tonight and look around for you. 

wae
wae PowerDork
8/23/22 7:34 a.m.
XLR99 (Forum Supporter) said:

I think I got about 40k out of it (?), so definitely not OEM durability.  Ended up throwing a spare in the trunk.  The failure mode I got was 'Runs Fine' -> 'Dead', there wasnt any misfiring action first though.

I also noticed the ground wire to the head is pretty green, could that be contributing?

Yeah, that is pretty ugly for sure.  We tried running a jumper cable from the negative post on the battery to the bolt connecting the green ground to the head but it didn't change how it ran.  It stabilized the running voltage a bit, so I wouldn't say that replacing that ground wire would be a waste.

Slippery
Slippery GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
8/23/22 8:51 a.m.

Looks like you guys are making good progress eliminating possible problem sources and everything points to the distributor.

Is there anyway of knowing if one is good or bad at the junkyard? I can keep an eye out next time I am out there ... even though I think these cars are very rare at the jy nowadays.

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/23/22 10:18 a.m.

Pulled the trigger on an aftermarket distributor from RA. Should get us through the challenge and hopefully will fix the misfire 

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/26/22 1:38 p.m.

Update: 

 

new distributor arrived, and went on very easy. 

 

fired up, seems a little smoother at times but still missing. 
 

Move on to checking fuel pressure 

Right on the money and no weird behavior

 

Seems like it's running on 3 cylinders based on sound

 

pull the exhaust heatshield and temp check each cylinder from PS to DS

281 F 304F 284F 206F

seems like cyl 1 is a bit colder than all the rest 

pull the plug 

squeaky clean. Wipes clean, can't really smell gas on it

 

pull cyl 2 and compare 

definite gas smell, some soot when plug is wiped. 

This was as far as I got during my lunch break. 

-new distributor is on and smoothed it out a little, but still not fixed

-confirmed fuel pressure is good

-confirmed cyl 1 is not operating the same as 2/3/4
 

It looks like possibly cyl 1 might not be getting fuel. Which could be dead or plugged injector? Injector wiring? 
 

Plan for next session is to swap 2 injectors and see if the issue follows the injector. 
If it follows, will need a rebuild or some how revive this one. 
Then move on to laundry list of other items; shocks (bolts arrived), bushings, vc gasket, alignment ...

happy to hear any tips on reviving or sourcing new injector 

wae
wae PowerDork
8/26/22 1:42 p.m.

The injector was definitely getting voltage from the harness.  And I'm fairly certain that I saw the little bump from the pintle operating, but for some reason I was having a heck of a time with noise.

Cooper_Tired
Cooper_Tired HalfDork
8/26/22 1:45 p.m.

In reply to wae :

Good call; forgot the voltage was already checked 

Slippery
Slippery GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
8/26/22 1:46 p.m.

If the coil on the injector is stuck, a couple of small whacks with a wrench can set it free. Might be worth trying.

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