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Feedyurhed
Feedyurhed UltraDork
10/4/22 4:30 p.m.
David S. Wallens said:

Hyundai and Kia have come so, so far in the last 10 or 15 years. And then add in the warranty. 

From J.D. Power for 2022:

Wow. What happened to Honda/Acura?

P5Racer (formerly BMWGeoff)
P5Racer (formerly BMWGeoff) GRM+ Memberand Reader
10/4/22 4:46 p.m.

Does anyone else find it funny that Dodge is near the top, but Ram and Chrysler are near the bottom?

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/5/22 8:08 a.m.

In reply to Feedyurhed :

You don't want to know. 

kevinatfms
kevinatfms GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
10/5/22 8:37 a.m.

Ours works pretty well so far!

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/5/22 9:16 a.m.

In reply to APEowner :

Started with the reorg in 2000 and the aquisition of Kia. Since then theyhave been developing their product line in an odd but obviously functional way.

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/5/22 9:38 a.m.

In reply to kevinatfms :

We posting Hy/Kia racecars? 

No photo description available.

No photo description available.

No photo description available.

May be an image of car and road

There's a couple more that photos have disappeared on.

Colin Wood
Colin Wood Associate Editor
10/5/22 12:59 p.m.

In reply to bobzilla :

I'll accept photos of Hyundai and Kia race cars in this thread.

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/5/22 1:42 p.m.

Been doing this Korean thing a while now. It was fun to be the local "benchmark" for decently quick. The "Dude, you got raw timed by a Kia!:" comments were always my favorite.

ChrisHosford
ChrisHosford
10/5/22 6:08 p.m.

Hand in hands?  Who, me?  Ahhh, that would be a yes.

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/6/22 8:16 a.m.

Found another. That time the tib was broken/not ready so I took the wife's automatic Forte Koup to autox with 245's. 

No photo description available.

Peabody
Peabody MegaDork
10/6/22 9:18 a.m.
David S. Wallens said:

Hyundai and Kia have come so, so far in the last 10 or 15 years. And then add in the warranty

From J.D. Power for 2022:

They must have taken those surveys before they caught fire, or started knocking.

The warranty is useless if they won't honour it, and it continues to be a problem getting them to.

I'm still on a FB group from when I had my Kia and it's still almost daily that somebody's asking about the recalls and extended warranty program that they were basically fined ($210 mil) into providing. I liked my car while I had it, and considered replacing it with another, but between all the engine problems, corporate doing everything in their power to deny warranty, and the horrible dealer experience, there was no way I could trust the cars, and no way I would reward them with my business again.

Sorry to rain on your parade

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
10/6/22 9:43 a.m.

In reply to Peabody :

FWIW, my brother got 10 trouble-free years out of his Soul. He had a problem towards the end, and they covered it under warranty. He replaced it with a Kona. 

dannyp84
dannyp84 Reader
10/6/22 10:26 a.m.

In reply to bobzilla :

Was the Tiburon competitive? Those cars were EVERYWHERE when I was in high school but I never see them anymore. 

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/6/22 10:35 a.m.
David S. Wallens said:

In reply to Peabody :

FWIW, my brother got 10 trouble-free years out of his Soul. He had a problem towards the end, and they covered it under warranty. He replaced it with a Kona. 

I added the miles and years and number of cars in my stable and friends and it matches this experience. People with problems are always more vocal than those happy. The rule of thumb was one happy customer might tell 10 friends. One unhappy customer will tell everyone. 

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/6/22 10:38 a.m.
dannyp84 said:

In reply to bobzilla :

Was the Tiburon competitive? Those cars were EVERYWHERE when I was in high school but I never see them anymore. 

Sadly no. But it was fun. 245's, stiff coilovers and big brakes were a hoot. 

ProDarwin
ProDarwin MegaDork
10/6/22 10:43 a.m.
David S. Wallens said:

In reply to Peabody :

FWIW, my brother got 10 trouble-free years out of his Soul. He had a problem towards the end, and they covered it under warranty. He replaced it with a Kona. 

My unfortunately still hasnt died or miracululously turned into a better car.  It still does all the appliance things pretty well without complaining (unlike me lol).

Its pretty young though, its a 2013 with <130k on it.  If it is in this kind of condition in another 10 years/100k miles I would be very impressed.

Kreb (Forum Supporter)
Kreb (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
10/6/22 11:06 a.m.
Peabody said:
 

They must have taken those surveys before they caught fire, or started knocking.

The warranty is useless if they won't honour it, and it continues to be a problem getting them to.

I'm still on a FB group from when I had my Kia and it's still almost daily that somebody's asking about the recalls and extended warranty program that they were basically fined ($210 mil) into providing. I liked my car while I had it, and considered replacing it with another, but between all the engine problems, corporate doing everything in their power to deny warranty, and the horrible dealer experience, there was no way I could trust the cars, and no way I would reward them with my business again.

Sorry to rain on your parade

The problem is that we get our information through the media which has an innate negativity bias. So when one hears about battery fires, bearing failures, or whatever the problem du jour is it's very hard to put it in perspective. Is this a little issue or a big one? Is the local dealer helpful or a douche? My son loves his Sonata and its been problem free. I've also hit the backroads very hard in a group that included a Stinger and a Sonata N line and can attest that they are fast and capable cars.

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
10/6/22 11:23 a.m.
bobzilla said:
David S. Wallens said:

In reply to Peabody :

FWIW, my brother got 10 trouble-free years out of his Soul. He had a problem towards the end, and they covered it under warranty. He replaced it with a Kona. 

I added the miles and years and number of cars in my stable and friends and it matches this experience. People with problems are always more vocal than those happy. The rule of thumb was one happy customer might tell 10 friends. One unhappy customer will tell everyone. 

I can see that. I forget the problem that my brother's Soul had. Oddly, it was covered by a recall on the years before and after his. So he said something. And they covered it. 

The Soul was a good car for him–manual transmission, too. He seems very happy with the Kona. 

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/6/22 11:23 a.m.

In reply to ProDarwin :

Yeah they don't usually get better. The good news is after about 10 years you've hit peak deterioration. The early 2000's cars was about 3 years. Lol. Still cockroaches with basic maintenance 

Peabody
Peabody MegaDork
10/6/22 12:37 p.m.

In reply to Kreb (Forum Supporter) :

I think a bigger problem is when people use anecdotal evidence to downplay what have been very serious and well documented  problems with a manufacturer

MiniDave
MiniDave Reader
10/6/22 1:13 p.m.

I see Land Rover/Range Rover is still on the bottom!

But it's nice to see MINI has improved significantly.....

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/6/22 1:21 p.m.

In reply to Peabody :

In my 14 years slinging parts I saw a ton of issues with Honda/Acura. Worse than whatever Hyundai has going right now. But they are still regarded as the chosen ones in the automotive world. 

I'm at 8 Hyundai/Kia cars in our possession since 2002, never a year where we didn't have at least 1. Those 8 cars had/have a combined 1.1 million miles on them. 1 engine replaced (bought with snapped timing belt because neglect) and one transmission replaced (wife thought a 12" curb was a good option to take a 13" wheel over at 20mph). One car had to be towed home leaving the wife stranded because at 220k miles the crank sensor died. $19 later it was back on the road.

I know that's anecdotal and all. Inlaws have been converted from Honda/Toyota to Kia people. 2 cars, 8 years of ownership 250k miles. No issues. Multiple friends with 150k mile daily driver cars without issue and one that had a free engine at 140k miles.

You're right. they are nothing but trash and everyone should ditch them at once! (I miss the days when used they were cheap)

ProDarwin
ProDarwin MegaDork
10/6/22 1:47 p.m.
Peabody said:

In reply to Kreb (Forum Supporter) :

I think a bigger problem is when people use anecdotal evidence to downplay what have been very serious and well documented  problems with a manufacturer

To be fair your original post "raining on the parade" uses anecdotal evidence to up-play the problem with the manufacturer.

I would be interested in seeing hard data on the engine failures.  What specific engine did you have?  Everything I have read is specific to the 2.4 or earlier 2.0T (i.e. not Veloster/N cars).  It seems E36 M3ty and they made some bad motors, but they are certainly not the first big name manufacturer to do that.  I wonder how they handled it compares to the others.

 

 

Anecdotally, would I recommend one to another person?  Depends.  There are a lot of design annoyances with the couple models I have had that would drive a performance oriented driver bonkers.  Would I recommend for an appliance?  Sure, but no more/less than a Honda or Toyota.

bobzilla
bobzilla MegaDork
10/6/22 2:12 p.m.

In reply to ProDarwin :

From a performance oriented perspective (on older, no idea what the new N cars are like) there are things you have to drive around or find ways of fixing. The good thing is they are a lot like Honda/GM where they parts bin the E36 M3 out of these cars. On certain years of Elantras you could have brake bits from 3 different cars of that era (Sonata, XG and Tiburon). But no they didn't have an ITR type out of the box car that just worked. The First gen forte had great torque curves and a really good suspension and brakes when tweaked but the gearing of the trans was terrible.... something the 12-17 Rio has as well. The older cars were either floppy chassis and good suspension bits or good chassis and E36 M3 suspension. Brakes were always undersized (until 2010). Ergonomically they were fine IMO but they were never top tier quality materials.

Would I recomend a new one? Absolutely. An old one? Maybe. 

David S. Wallens
David S. Wallens Editorial Director
10/6/22 2:36 p.m.

Well, some of you are going to love the car arriving later today.

And some of you might not....

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