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Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
4/1/22 1:25 p.m.

Wow that trans has nice ratios!

Tom1200
Tom1200 UltraDork
4/1/22 1:58 p.m.

As for the MSRP: 45K gouged to 52K is my current prediction.

gearheadmb
gearheadmb UltraDork
4/1/22 2:03 p.m.

I think we are in the golden age of factory performance. But........................

It's a hot hatch that makes 300 hp, and still isn't quite to the 1hp/10lbs mark. I know we've beat this dead horse many times on this forum, but cars need to be lighter.

Tom1200
Tom1200 UltraDork
4/1/22 2:12 p.m.

In reply to gearheadmb :

It's difficult to make cars lighter given all that has to and all that's expected to go into them.

My little Datsun wieghs 1600lbs..................you do not want to crash in that thing (it's why mine has such a stout cage). All that crash protection adds weight.

AWD & Turbos (what the demographic expects) add weight.

Infotainment adds weight.

3200lbs for an AWD turbo is pretty good.

Erich
Erich UberDork
4/1/22 2:16 p.m.

Just as a little perspective, the US-market WRX debuted at about $24k purchase price. That's $48k inflation adjusted. 

Error404
Error404 HalfDork
4/1/22 2:29 p.m.
Tom1200 said:

In reply to gearheadmb :

Infotainment adds weight

If they'd ditch that weight then I would be noticeably more interested, from both a weight and simplicity perspective.

obsolete
obsolete GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
4/1/22 2:30 p.m.
stafford1500 said:

Interesting to note that it is port injected and not direct injected

If what I've read elsewhere is correct, it is actually both.

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
4/1/22 2:32 p.m.
stafford1500 said:

In case you want more specs: 

Interesting to note that it is port injected and not direct injected

https://pressroom.toyota.com/heat-for-the-streets-toyota-debuts-first-ever-gr-corolla

The full press release from Toyota seems to indicate a similar D-4S system like on the Twins:

 

  • 1.6L, 3-cylinder direct/port injected turbo engine delivers 300 hp and 273 pound-feet of torque


 

z31maniac
z31maniac MegaDork
4/1/22 2:37 p.m.
Error404 said:
Tom1200 said:

In reply to gearheadmb :

Infotainment adds weight

If they'd ditch that weight then I would be noticeably more interested, from both a weight and simplicity perspective.

The big screen is basically the weight of an iPad, so I don't think removing it would make a big difference. 

Ian F (Forum Supporter)
Ian F (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
4/1/22 2:44 p.m.
z31maniac said:
Error404 said:
Tom1200 said:

In reply to gearheadmb :

Infotainment adds weight

If they'd ditch that weight then I would be noticeably more interested, from both a weight and simplicity perspective.

The big screen is basically the weight of an iPad, so I don't think removing it would make a big difference. 

And from a manufacturing POV, those big screens seem to reduce the number of components in the dash, thus making assembly more simple... Simple to the user is less of a concern.    I tend to agree - my 2017 Dodge is about as complicated as I want a car to be. And it's basically just a double-DIN stereo. The integrated navigation is crap compared to Google maps on my phone.  I honestly don't know why manufacturers even bother.  Now if I could get the screen to be a duplicate/extension of my phone, then I'll be interested... maybe it is that way in some cars. 

pointofdeparture
pointofdeparture GRM+ Memberand UltimaDork
4/1/22 2:52 p.m.
Ian F (Forum Supporter) said:

Now if I could get the screen to be a duplicate/extension of my phone, then I'll be interested... maybe it is that way in some cars. 

That's literally what Apple CarPlay and Google Android Auto are, and most new cars support one or both. The Corolla being discussed here supports both, AFAIK.

After having it in my '16 GTI I've put an aftermarket unit with CarPlay support in every vehicle I've owned since, it's fantastic.

Driven5
Driven5 UberDork
4/1/22 3:07 p.m.

The only thing I really don't like about it isn't GR specific... The stupid rear/hatch back designs that reduce the functional reason for having a hatch back in the first place. I suppose it's fine if you have a lot of triangular or trapezoidal shaped stuff to carry, but what a waste of already limited space for the majority of rectangular-ish profile stuff.

Beyond that, cool car! I'm glad to see the weight isn't quite as bad as many had feared... Although I wonder whether that is for the metal or CF roof, and what the difference is between the two.

Driven5
Driven5 UberDork
4/1/22 3:13 p.m.
gearheadmb said:

I know we've beat this dead horse many times on this forum, but cars need to be lighter.

Define "need". It's apparently cheaper and easier to hit the performance efficiency targets on a heavier car, than it is to hit the safety and quality targets on a lighter car. How many $/lb extra are you willing to pay manufacturers to ge the weight down?

emcj7550
emcj7550 New Reader
4/1/22 3:30 p.m.

Assuming it's a decent car...price and availability will be key to its success. If Toyota can make them for a reasonable price and can make enough of them, it stands a chance. However, if they price it at or above it's realistic competition, and/or they're too few available to keep the dealers from "market adjusting" the price out of reach even further, then it's Supra-sayonara time.

The problem with cars like this is, except for rare occasions, the people who want to own them can't afford them and the people who can afford them are looking at a Golf R or used RS3 or Porsche or something...not a $50,000 Corolla. 

On the other hand, I can only only giddily stand up and cheer Toyota for actually creating a car like this , in this day and age. Imagine the corporate balls it took to green-light something this absurd and wonderful...and in freaking manual only!!! I really hope it doesn't crash and burn. I'm not holding my breath here...

Gearheadotaku (Forum Supporter) said:

 

How long is that engine going to last? I don't see a highly stressed powerplant like that not being a maintenance nightmare. (Head gaskets, turbos, and a million little hoses and sensors. Ok, every new car is like that)

 

Sleeves

Tom1200
Tom1200 UltraDork
4/1/22 4:37 p.m.
Error404 said:
Tom1200 said:

In reply to gearheadmb :

Infotainment adds weight

If they'd ditch that weight then I would be noticeably more interested, from both a weight and simplicity perspective.

And this is why I buy open wheel race cars.

yupididit
yupididit GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
4/1/22 4:59 p.m.
Dusterbd13-michael said:
Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) 

 

Side rant.  Dealers say selling direct to customers is not fare, so how is having a monopoly on who you can buy it from, then let them charge market adjustments. One wasy or the other, no cake and eating it too.

Market adjustment is exactly why i didn't buy a maverick. Or srt4 new.

Gotta be a better way. 

Inquired on a new G Wagon today, $100k over MSRP market adjustment surprise

pheller
pheller UltimaDork
4/1/22 5:35 p.m.

Do you think there might be some way of beating the market adjustment? 

Whether it's buying a car across the country, or thru something like Carvana? 

I could actually see stretching a bit for this vehicle if I could get the Core Model at $30k.

In reply to pheller :

You won't see the core within $6500 of that mark, pre any "market adjustment" 

Teh E36 M3
Teh E36 M3 UltraDork
4/1/22 6:00 p.m.

Couple thoughts:

 

1. 3249 lbs? How can they get it that heavy?  
2. These pricing predictions seem awfully high. Can Toyota make an interior that remotely lives in the same universe as the Audi, pardon me, Golf R or GTI? I can get a similar weight/power and option from the R that is fairly suBtle, so I wonder what they are bringing to the table that differentiates.  God that means I'm getting old, doesn't it. 
3. Tangentially related. The Toyota dealer has two tacomas (4wd, auto, double cab, short box) on the lot. $9995 dealer value markup on both. This dealer sucks, yes, but I'd expect that to be the norm until their lots start filling back up. 

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
4/1/22 6:08 p.m.

In reply to Teh E36 M3 :

That is only 189lb more than a base Corolla hatch.  Not bad considering the all wheel drive system. 

It looks like base 2022 Corollas already have 18" wheels, and the larger brake rotors on the GR are probably offset by the calipers, which I assume are aluminum.

VolvoHeretic
VolvoHeretic GRM+ Memberand Reader
4/1/22 6:49 p.m.

My mom always said-If you can't say anything nice... but what's up with that cars face? I mean front end.

CyberEric
CyberEric Dork
4/1/22 7:08 p.m.

Reading more of the specs, this is the most exciting car Toyota has made since.... I'm thinking the last gen Supra. (I don't count the Twins or current Supra). I can't think of anything Toyota (actually Toyota, not BMW or Subaru) has sold in the US that is this interesting in a LONG time.

We are talking about a car that weighs less than the Evo/STi, makes similar power, has Toyota reliability, some functional usability, and could actually be affordable (if we are lucky). Btw, salient point above about the price of a WRX adjusted for inflation. 

This car weighs 189 lbs more than a regular Corolla despite having AWD. That's absurd in this day in age! For perspective, it weighs about what a Veloster N weighs, depending on the spec. The Veloster is a FWD car. This has AWD and more power.

And random side note that furthers my interest: have you noticed that it has 18" wheels?! In a world where everyone has 20's, I find it very refreshing to see an 18' wheel again. Reduced unsprung weight not to mention reduced tire prices.

I really hope this thing is priced right and that they make a lot of them so it doesn't get treated like the CTR and FoRS did. 

I am really excited about this car! It seems like a perfect GRM car to me. 

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
4/1/22 7:13 p.m.

For more perspective, it is roughly the exterior size of a CTR, which weighs a little over a hundred pounds less, while making the same power and not having all wheel drive.

Berck
Berck Reader
4/1/22 7:36 p.m.

I called the local dealer this afternoon to express interest and am #10 on the list in Colorado Springs.  Sounds like there's real interest, but then there was for the GR86 and they totally managed to screw that up.  I'm not willing to pay a bunch of dealer markup, so we'll see what happens.  Also seems unlikely that a Colorado Springs dealer is going to actually get 10 of them?  I was eventually able to get the Focus RS for MSRP and no one thought that would happen, but it took waiting until the end of 2017 when everyone who had one already got one and the rest were happy to pay ADM on the 2018 models for the fancy front diff.  But that was all back when you could actually buy new cars.

I'm skeptical about whether it'll actually have Toyota reliability given that absurd power to displacement ratio, but I haven't seen much in the way of horror stories from the GR Yaris?  Also wonder how usable the back seat is--I was pretty disappointed by the cramped back seat in the RS as compared to the roomy one in the WRX.  Looks like a lot less cargo area too.  Still, I don't know how else to encourage car makers to make the thing I want other than going out and buying the thing when they do!

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