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MitchellC
MitchellC HalfDork
7/13/09 10:42 p.m.

Just for verification, Osterkraut's WRX was a cream puff the last time I saw it. Pretty much showroom fresh... until someone dinged the fender a week after he got it.

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/13/09 10:43 p.m.
Osterkraut wrote: You're a weird dude. Double his price? Yeah. Great advice. Funny logic. Really, really funny logic. In fact, this is so weird, that I'm beginning to think you work for Subaru North America and this is a clever ploy to market cars.

I'm not sure if you're intending to address me, but if so, then happy to amuse. Oh, and trust me, if I worked for Subaru of NA, I would certainly not be doing anything to discourage someone from purchasing an 2002,104k mile WRX for $10k. They would not like that. -Doug

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/13/09 10:57 p.m.
Brust wrote: Bummer that you can't interview all previous owners for crooked/backward hat types smoking said weed while performing 7k clutch drops.

You raise a good point. When you buy a used car from a dealer, the Hx is pretty much lost to you, aside from the scant details provided by a carfax. That is why I much prefer to buy a used car from a private party. One owner cars are obviously best in that respect. You get to meet the person/people that were driving and caring for your "new" car, in order to make absolutely sure they were nothing like me.-Doug

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/13/09 11:01 p.m.
MitchellC wrote: Just for verification, Osterkraut's WRX was a cream puff the last time I saw it. Pretty much showroom fresh... until someone dinged the fender a week after he got it.

Huh? -Doug

Osterkraut
Osterkraut Dork
7/13/09 11:02 p.m.
Dpvog wrote:
Osterkraut wrote: You're a weird dude. Double his price? Yeah. Great advice. Funny logic. Really, really funny logic. In fact, this is so weird, that I'm beginning to think you work for Subaru North America and this is a clever ploy to market cars.
I'm not sure if you're intending to address me, but if so, then happy to amuse. Oh, and trust me, if I worked for Subaru of NA, I would certainly not be doing anything to discourage someone from purchasing an 2002,104k mile WRX for $10k. They would not like that. -Doug

Yeah, I addressed you, Mr. Subaru marketing dude. I'm on to you now!

As I've stated previously, I don't think he should buy it for $10k either, but buying a 2002, 104k mile WRX for what it's worth (~$8k from a dealer) isn't the world ending disaster you marketing types are making it out to be.

MitchellC wrote: Just for verification, Osterkraut's WRX was a cream puff the last time I saw it. Pretty much showroom fresh... until someone dinged the fender a week after he got it.

I sometimes wish I had bought an example with more miles. I also sometimes feel guilty, letting it boil away in the Texas sun, unable to get a good wash and wax, filling it with furniture, strapping a mattress to the roof, etc.

Then I remember it's a Subaru, and a daily driver. I'm not ready to drive at high speeds down gravel roads, though.

Still, it's aged faster in the 6 months I've had it that the rest of it's sheltered life. Sad.

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/13/09 11:14 p.m.

Osterkraut wrote: "Yeah, I addressed you, Mr. Subaru marketing dude. I'm on to you now!... As I've stated previously, I don't think he should buy it for $10k either, but buying a 2002, 104k mile WRX for what it's worth (~$8k from a dealer) isn't the world ending disaster you marketing types are making it out to be."

Shhhhh! Not so loud. I'm going to lose my Subaru marketing position. Seriously, if he said he was going to buy the car from, I don't know, say, a friend of the family, and he had all the service records from day one and knew exactly how the car was driven then great! In that case, I'd be all for this, even at eight grand, and with nothing in the trunk but a few dry seeds and the spare. I'd also be all for purchasing a WRX with 30k miles for the $11k that you paid for yours. It's the ten grand from a dealer and 104k miles on the clock that makes it a "no go" for us Subaru marketing types.-Doug

wherethefmi
wherethefmi Dork
7/13/09 11:32 p.m.
Dpvog wrote: Osterkraut wrote: "Yeah, I addressed you, Mr. Subaru marketing dude. I'm on to you now!... As I've stated previously, I don't think he should buy it for $10k either, but buying a 2002, 104k mile WRX for what it's worth (~$8k from a dealer) isn't the world ending disaster you marketing types are making it out to be." Shhhhh! Not so loud. I'm going to lose my Subaru marketing position. Seriously, if he said he was going to buy the car from, I don't know, say, a friend of the family, and he had all the service records from day one and knew exactly how the car was driven then great! In that case, I'd be all for this, even at eight grand, and with nothing in the trunk but a few dry seeds and the spare. I'd also be all for purchasing a WRX with 30k miles for the $11k that you paid for yours. It's the ten grand from a dealer and 104k miles on the clock that makes it a "no go" for us Subaru marketing types.-Doug

Have you never negotiated a deal with a dealer before? I have and I usually knock a 17K car down to 15 even 14.5, I'm sure I could walk into that dealer with 8K and drive out with that car. I wouldn't feel a bit of buyers remorse once I ripped out the down pipe, installed a catless up/downpipe combo and re flashed the car to a stout 280 hp on premium, without spending more than 600 in parts for a damn fast car.

I felt a twinge of guilt modding my 06 cause it was new, I wouldn't have the slightest in ripping hesitation in ripping that car apart to make it faster, lighter, and handle better.

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/13/09 11:42 p.m.
Osterkraut wrote:

Still, it's aged faster in the 6 months I've had it that the rest of it's sheltered life. Sad.

I know exactly what you mean. That's why I really like the multi-car approach that Neon was talking about earlier when he was thinking about getting a Miata. Many years ago, before my marketing career with Subaru, I discovered that it was better (for me, anyway) to have two or three less expensive used cars rather than a single more expensive new one. That way I could have a winter beater, a sports car, and a GT, and each car could perform it's dedicated task better than any one car could perform all tasks. But if you're going to pick one car to do everything, I think you've got the right one. Flexibility, Its What Makes a Subaru, a Subaru! (Sorry, they make me slip that in.) -Doug

wherethefmi
wherethefmi Dork
7/13/09 11:50 p.m.

I thought the new slogan was about "love". This guy confuses me

Osterkraut
Osterkraut Dork
7/13/09 11:57 p.m.
wherethefmi wrote: I thought the new slogan was about "love". This guy confuses me

No, THIS is confusing: "less expensive used cars rather than a single more expensive new one."

But I got a chuckle out of his, "Many years ago, before my marketing career with Subaru" so he can't be all bad. I know his type, awkward at bars sometimes, but good for a laugh.

wherethefmi
wherethefmi Dork
7/14/09 12:03 a.m.

Yeah I don't hate him, that's for sure, Doug be a little more easy going, like you've been the last few posts and you'll do okay here, oh and be consistent.

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/14/09 12:28 a.m.
wherethefmi wrote: Have you never negotiated a deal with a dealer before? I have and I usually knock a 17K car down to 15 even 14.5, I'm sure I could walk into that dealer with 8K and drive out with that car. I wouldn't feel a bit of buyers remorse once I ripped out the down pipe, installed a catless up/downpipe combo and re flashed the car to a stout 280 hp on premium, without spending more than 600 in parts for a damn fast car. I felt a twinge of guilt modding my 06 cause it was new, I wouldn't have the slightest in ripping hesitation in ripping that car apart to make it faster, lighter, and handle better.

I have negotiated deals with car dealers, sometimes for four vehicles at once. I know what is possible, but I don't know what is possible for Neon. All I know of this situation is that he said he was looking at a 7 y.o. WRX with 104k miles from a dealer. It seemed to me that he was asking me/you/us whether that seemed like a good deal/ reasonable purchase/ reasonable price. My answer was, and continues to be.... RUN! RUN AWAY!!!! RUN FOR YOUR LIFE!!!

Why? Because from my point of view, a car dealer is a skilled professional. He pays for his mortgage, pays for his clothes, and food, and vacations, sends his kids to college, buys his Harley Davidson Fat Boy and his Larson 24ft Comfort Plus Bow Rider, (with the Honda Four Stroke) builds the new addition over the garage, and even pays for his wife's tennis lessons (with Andre) at the club by selling cars to most folks for a lot more than they're worth. Yet when you talk to people right after they bought a car, 84% of Americans think they got a "better than average" deal. Hmmm? Now since Neon was expressing interest in what seemed to be a severely overpriced, high mileage car, that only heightened my concern. So I said "Don't do it..." in the same way I would have if someone asked me if I thought it was safe to walk into that burning building. By the way, I'm always smiling as I type, and I'm always joking, even when its not funny-Doug

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/14/09 12:46 a.m.
wherethefmi wrote: Yeah I don't hate him, that's for sure, Doug be a little more easy going, like you've been the last few posts and you'll do okay here, oh and be consistent.

Uh oh, this could get ugly! When was I not consistent?-Doug

wherethefmi
wherethefmi Dork
7/14/09 1:00 a.m.
Dpvog wrote:
wherethefmi wrote: Yeah I don't hate him, that's for sure, Doug be a little more easy going, like you've been the last few posts and you'll do okay here, oh and be consistent.
Uh oh, this could get ugly! When was I not consistent?-Doug

When you told him to go buy a NEW car, then told him to buy several cheaper used cars for the same money, which could all be bigger basket cases you claim to try to be getting him out of in the first place. When you said the new impreza was just as good a car as a used WRX, even though as a SUBARU employee you know that to be false.

I'm done arguing with you, you will not be swayed from your point of view whichever one that is, I'm losing track.

Were so far off topic from the original post, this thread has become useless.

Brust
Brust Reader
7/14/09 1:12 a.m.

They're giving these things away on the island: http://honolulu.craigslist.org/oah/cto/1262522930.html (88k, $8.5) http://honolulu.craigslist.org/oah/cto/1260818434.html (86k, $6k) http://honolulu.craigslist.org/oah/cto/1252555619.html (117k, $6k) http://honolulu.craigslist.org/oah/cto/1251368755.html (83k, $8k)

Sheesh. Too bad it costs a mint to ship.

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/14/09 6:42 a.m.
wherethefmi wrote: Yeah I don't hate him, that's for sure, Doug be a little more easy going, like you've been the last few posts and you'll do okay here, oh and be consistent.

dpvog wrote:

Uh oh, this could get ugly! When was I not consistent?-Doug

wherethefmi wrote:

When you told him to go buy a NEW car, then told him to buy several cheaper used cars for the same money, which could all be bigger basket cases you claim to try to be getting him out of in the first place. When you said the new impreza was just as good a car as a used WRX, even though as a SUBARU employee you know that to be false. dpvog wrote:

All I was trying to do was offer him a safer alternative to the 104k mile $10k WRX. If he had said: "I have 10k to spend, what should I get?" I would NOT have said, "Stretch yourself another 5k and buy a new Subaru." I only suggested the new Impreza as a safer alternative to what might have been a very used WRX. The multiple used cars would have been my original response if Neon had asked a more open ended question. As it happens, Neon himself later brought up the possibility of the Miata, so I then took the opening, switched gears, and offered my vote in favor of what I believed was a better option than any that had been offered so far. I don't think I was being inconsistent, only flexible enough to respond to the expanded range of choices that Neon himself provided.

As for encouraging him to buy used cars "which could be bigger basketcases" than the $10k WRX with 104k miles and a blind Hx; of course, anything's possible, but I would suggest that Neon look for cars from private parties, (rather than dealers) with a documented Hx, and with much lower mileage. As for the used WRX being a better car than the new Impreza, or vice versa, I think they have different advantages and disadvantages. I would definitely say the new Impreza is a safer bet as the DD for a younger guy who might not have that much extra breathing room in his budget, but given the reaction my suggestion got, I doubt I'd make it again! Maybe I'll see if there are any openings over at Honda. -Doug

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/14/09 8:23 a.m.
Kiponator wrote: Since then, Subaru de-contented the NA Impreza for the redesign to move the pricepoint lower --- rear drum brakes ? Really!

Wow! I had no idea a new Impreza had rear drums. What a joke. I had to check the Subaru website to see it with my own eyes. Subaru should be completely ashamed of themselves for deciding to save that very cheesy $68.47. And, yes, I'm being totally serious, at least about this, anyway. -Doug

Dav
Dav New Reader
7/14/09 10:13 p.m.

Anecdotal obviously, but WRXes are not owned only by speed junkies or punks that beat the crap out of them. I know of a woman in her 70's that bought a new 5-spd bugeye WRX wagon and a physicist in his 60's that bought a new 5-spd bugeye sedan--and babied them. They both were also Sedona Red Pearl... hmm... .

Brust
Brust Reader
7/15/09 1:51 a.m.

And I bought one that I don't even drive. The wife, who thinks it's fun and "zippy", but drives it like a granny. Maybe I just like the idea that I have it, and that "someday" I'll autocross. Been reading this stinking magazine 15 years and still haven't made an autocross/track day.

njansenv
njansenv Reader
7/15/09 5:54 a.m.

I figure the Sedona Red Pearl wagons are the least likely to get beat on...wagons in particular seem to be less loved by teh punk crowd. :)

Nathan

wherethefmi
wherethefmi Dork
7/15/09 7:45 a.m.

dude get out and go autocross, wow!

Strizzo
Strizzo Dork
7/15/09 8:32 a.m.
Brust wrote: They're giving these things away on the island: http://honolulu.craigslist.org/oah/cto/1262522930.html (88k, $8.5) http://honolulu.craigslist.org/oah/cto/1260818434.html (86k, $6k) http://honolulu.craigslist.org/oah/cto/1252555619.html (117k, $6k) http://honolulu.craigslist.org/oah/cto/1251368755.html (83k, $8k) Sheesh. Too bad it costs a mint to ship.

i don't think its that bad. some family friends moved to HI a couple years ago, and i seem to recall that it was only about a grand or so. he was driving the car from FL to San Diego because it cut the cost of shipping almost in half, so i'd guess it would be about the same as shipping from east coast to west. then again, on the islands, with 85-100k on a car, you'd know that its not likely that they were all highway miles either.

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/15/09 8:51 a.m.
Dav wrote: WRXes are not owned only by speed junkies or punks that beat the crap out of them. I know of a woman in her 70's that bought a new 5-spd bugeye WRX wagon and a physicist in his 60's that bought a new 5-spd bugeye sedan--and babied them. They both were also Sedona Red Pearl... hmm... .

Nice. If Neon could hook up with a deal like that from a neighbor, the guy down the street, his old high school coach, or even just a classified ad or craigslist deal where he could meet the dude, now that would be much better than the random car off the dealer's lot. It makes me nervous to tell him to buy a WRX when he doesn't know if it was owned by a physicist or if it was some spoiled brat's high school graduation present, especially with the 104k miles.- Doug

sanman
sanman New Reader
7/15/09 9:21 a.m.

Neon, I am actually in the same situation and was considering similar options. Having lived near Ithaca, I know the weather isn't pleasant. However, when I weighted the option of trading my Nissan in for something like a WRX or legacy GT, I began to realize that it wasn't worth it. For starters, I put a lot of new parts and labor in the car in recent years and realized that a 9 year old car I know is better than a more recent used car I don't. Also, my resale value is crap and I assume the case is worse with the Neon. Thus, I am taking the $5k I have and finding the nicest miata I can. That way I have an extra car if the dd goes down and I don't care as much if the miata goes down. Plus, insurance isn't terrible on a multi-car plan with a miata compared to a WRX DD.

Also, cheaper is the Grassroots way.

Dpvog
Dpvog New Reader
7/15/09 10:42 a.m.
sanman wrote: Neon, I am actually in the same situation and was considering similar options. Having lived near Ithaca, I know the weather isn't pleasant. However, when I weighed the option of trading my Nissan in for something like a WRX or legacy GT, I began to realize that it wasn't worth it. For starters, I put a lot of new parts and labor in the car in recent years and realized that a 9 year old car I know is better than a more recent used car I don't. Also, my resale value is crap and I assume the case is worse with the Neon. Thus, I am taking the $5k I have and finding the nicest miata I can. That way I have an extra car if the dd goes down and I don't care as much if the miata goes down. Plus, insurance isn't terrible on a multi-car plan with a miata compared to a WRX DD. Also, cheaper is the Grassroots way.

Everything that Sanman said! Absolutely YES! Even better! Neon, if we're voting and you're still following the string, I second the motion! If you shop carefully and are willing to look around for a while, $5k +/- should get you an early Miata garage queen with under 60k miles that has never seen a single snowflake.

http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/cto/1268376155.html

http://pittsburgh.craigslist.org/cto/1269094988.html

If you're really lucky, maybe even a one-owner car with factory paint and full service records. This, from my point of view, is the perfect answer! -Doug

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