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chandler
chandler UltimaDork
10/8/21 1:16 p.m.

The kits are listed in the price listing

mblommel
mblommel Dork
10/8/21 1:37 p.m.

In reply to chandler :

So $3750-ish for the LS kit and the manual trans parts. I guess that isnt terrible. Especially if you find a nonrunning XK8 coupe for cheap. 

jwagner (Forum Supporter)
jwagner (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand Reader
10/9/21 12:24 a.m.

I think they're great cars.  Really like the lines of the early version.  They're very competent road cars -  reasonably fast, handle well, and are comfortable.  And they're comparatively cheap since reliability is not their long suit and repairs are expensive, although the parts mostly are not big bucks.  This should be really appealing to the DIY GRM crowd, right? 

Sounds like I'm an outlier here, but I like the grand tourer just as it is.  If you want one with a LS and three pedals, save yourself a lot of money and work and buy a C5 Corvette.

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/9/21 7:46 a.m.
stroker said:

I'm half serious.  

Potentially a poor man's Aston Martin?

We don't like anything because everything sucks.

 

Mostly, I'd avoid a Jag because the company that now calls itself Jaguar does not support anything from before the name was bought.  "We are not that company anymore."

Oddly enough, this makes the older Jags (XJs) more sensible to buy, because there are cottage industries catering to them.

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/9/21 7:54 a.m.
iansane said:

I've never seen a master cylinder mounted vertically.

No?  I've seen it a handful of times on European and English cars.

It's probably the BEST way to mount those Girling master cylinders.  They work kinda weird.  What we think of as normal will have a piston that pushes fluid to the end of the bore, and towards the beginning of the bore there is a compensation port that allows fluid in from the reservoir, so the inlet port is closed by the piston moving past it.  Girling master cylinders allow fluid in from the end, and the pressure-out port is in the middle.  When you push the piston, there is a spring loaded cup on the end that covers over the fluid-in port, so fluid has nowhere else to go but pressure-out.  Mounting vertically, therefore, would make the master cylinder self-bleeding.

 

edit:  Looking at that picture.... there should be a fluid port in the brake reservoir for clutch fluid, every S-type/LS had one and that looks like the reservoir from one of those, why not use that instead of the cobby looking add on reservoir?

And while I'm ranting... wash your berking hands before you touch clean plastic.  That clutch reservoir looks disgusting.

dean1484
dean1484 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/9/21 8:24 a.m.

I have wanted a tin top for a while. I have been shopping them for about 5 years. The convertible to me looks like an after thought. The tin tops are much harder to find. I have two plans

1.  Do the LS swap with an Automatic and make it a tire melting monster but keep it as a grand touring car that you cross continents in style and comfort. 
 

2. Do a manual swap using the supercharged inline six. Aston's came configured this way so in theory it would be a bolt in swap. Tastefully strip it down to just a drivers car for casual track and weekend back road use.  

RaabTheSaab
RaabTheSaab New Reader
10/9/21 9:22 a.m.

In reply to jwagner (Forum Supporter) :

I’m with you. I’ll even throw in that I like the convertible versions. Some what tangentially, it reminds me of a conversation I had with my cousin when the 1st gen XK8s were new. He’s about a decade older than me and at the time was racing an FD RX7. We noticed a an XK parked along the beach and he said “huh, I like that”. I peered in and I said “ick, automatic though”. He shrugged and just said “yeah, it’s a luxury car”. That may have been the first time that it clicked in my brain that certain cars have their charms to be exploited. A drop top, automatic XK serves its intended purpose really well. And then race a highly modified FD if you’re looking for excitement. 

gearheadE30
gearheadE30 Dork
10/9/21 12:32 p.m.

It's a bit of a nit to pick I guess, but the rear bumper design has always bothered me enough on these to look elsewhere. Especially since the primary draw of this, vs any of the many other GT coupes out there, would be the 'classic' aesthetics. Darker colors hide hit better, but it just looks droopy and wrong to me.

 

 

GTwannaB
GTwannaB GRM+ Memberand HalfDork
10/9/21 11:38 p.m.

I think the XK8 is one of the most beautiful cars ever designed from an aesthetic standpoint. I also think Ian McCallum cribbed his beautiful design on every completely derivative design after that car. People treat him like a god, I think he designed one great car and thirty weaker copies. 

Chris_V
Chris_V UberDork
10/10/21 12:08 p.m.
dean1484 said:

I have wanted a tin top for a while. I have been shopping them for about 5 years. The convertible to me looks like an after thought.

I'm just the opposite. The coupe to me looks like the top is designed for a much smaller car, with to much sweep to the rear of it leading to too much tail. And the side window design looks a bunch too small. Look at the DB9 on how to do the coupe right on that basic body.  The convertible eliminates all that and looks more balance to my eye. I still want the later XKR convertible:

Although as DB9s come down in price... lol

yupididit
yupididit GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
10/10/21 3:06 p.m.

The xk8 coupe in question is overpriced and some. I'd buy it for $1200. 

First order of business would be a ls + 4l80 or 6l80 swap. 

They are really good looking in person even better than photos. I think the next gen of xk's are also very beautiful. 

dean1484
dean1484 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/10/21 4:20 p.m.

In reply to Chris_V :

Going to have to agree to disagree on this one. I think the convertible from the rear and in profile just look bad. Like the top was "good enough" and no thought to making the car look good. 

dean1484
dean1484 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/10/21 5:42 p.m.

Full disclosure I don't really like any convertible. 

jwagner (Forum Supporter)
jwagner (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand Reader
10/10/21 10:27 p.m.

This being a car geek forum, I understand the impulse to LS EVERYTHING!  But given the XK8/XKRs were 300/400HP I just don't see enough gain for the pain.

yupididit
yupididit GRM+ Memberand PowerDork
10/10/21 10:36 p.m.

In reply to jwagner (Forum Supporter) :

Though the xkr is more reliable than the xk8. The packaging sucks, the R's can heatsoak easy, stupid ass repairs for coolant hoses. Make decent power but not much can be done with them. Parts are not cheap. The non-supercharged cars aren't very reliable and kind of suck.

I own a xjr which is the same drivetrain as the xkr. 

 

nderwater
nderwater UltimaDork
10/10/21 11:23 p.m.

My in-laws have an XK8 vert. It's a softly sprung boat made for cruising the country club and gliding down the interstate. Zero desire to own one after my first drive. The XK that followed it was a whole different animal.

Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter)
Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/11/21 10:00 a.m.

This is a great thread as I've been thinking of starting one about KK8/R's for a while now.  My interest is slightly different from this thread, but perhaps this can become the repository of all X100 and X150 knowledge on here.

I've always liked these cars and one is in strong consideration as a replacement for my Boxster, along with a 911 cab and others.  Specifically, I'm looking for a 2+2 convertible sports/GT car.  When I say 2+2 it's not for humans in the back, it's for taking our super model with us on trips, not humans.  Meet Kioni the supermodel.

So we need a car with enough of a backseat for the Supermodel, but not enough room for human legs, so things like XK's, 911's etc. will work perfectly, but the Boxster doesn't.

What I want to know is what are real world expectations of running costs for these cars.  I'm not talking the standard GRM fare of bring cars back from the dead, swapping in LSx's and manual trans.  I have zero interest in that anymore, and as per a thread I posted a month or so ago, I've reached a point in life where I've list the passion for wrenching, and work, life and family leave almost no time for it anyway.  I'd be looking for a car to drive daily in the nice months and have major work (i.e. beyond oil changes, brake changes and simple suspension stuff) done by a local independent shop.

As far as X100 Vs X150 styling.  The X100 is a stunning in every angle other than the poorly integrated rear bumper.  That used to bug the hell out of me when they were new, but it's less obvious/objectionable now they are up to a quarter century old.  The X150 hit me as far better looking when it was launched, and it's still stunning, but these days I see the styling as a wash.  Interior, they both has their pros and cons, so again, a bit of a wash.  SO let's cover the mechanicals instead.

From the reading and talking to people I've done on and off over the last few years my gut feelings are:

  • Despite the 'It's a Jag, run away it will bankrupt you before you get it home' sentiment, the reality is these cars were launched under Ford ownership and other than some specific issues (year and model dependent, like any car out there) they are no less reliable than equivalent BMW, Merc, Audi and other European luxury cars, while having the benefit of a lot of cheaper, easily available Ford parts.  Certainly, better than a mid 00's BMW or Merc in its propensity for generating bills larger than its value.
  • Early 4.0L cars (97-03) had the Nikasil bore issues, but by now these have either died, been replaced or are fine if they've lasted this long so no real issue.
  • Timing chain tensioners were updated in 01 and after that are fine.
  • Upshot is 04 up 4.2L NA engines have gravity like reliability.
  • Supercharging the 04 up 4.2L engines adds a E36 M3 ton of heat which makes replacing all hoses (air and water) a good idea for long term reliability.
  • Both 4.2L engines were carried over to the X150 cars from 06-09 still with their great reliability.
  • Later 5.0L engines had a big power increase and I’m not aware of issues, although I am open to new info.
  • The early 5 speed NA trans can have issues (5HP24).  The early Supercharged 5 speed from Mercedes (W5A5805G) seems fine.  The later 6 speed ZF (6HP26) used on both NA and Blown from 02 up seems fine. 
  • 6HP26 was also carried over for the 06-09 X150 cars
  • 09 up cars all got the updated ZF 6HP28 trans and I’m not aware of any issues.
  • I like the traditional Jag old school J gate shifter as it’s unusual in having the correct orientation for ‘manual’ mode where forward is down, back is up.
  • Not a massive fan of the later rotary shifter on the 09 up X150 cars and don’t know about its reliability compared to the simple mechanical J shifter.
  • X100 cars are steel and based off a heavily revised XJS platform, so effectively it’s roots go back to the mid 60’s.  It was improved and refined over the decades, with few panels, and a revised rear suspension moving the rear brakes outboard, but its still and old, although effective platform.
  • The X150 cars are all aluminum bodies, which makes repairs more difficult, so you need to make sure it’s got a clean history.
  • Soft top mechanisms do have issues, but no worse than other luxury cars of the era.

So, what are peoples experience on running these things as dailies.  What have I missed?  My assumption would be purchasing a fully documented car which hasn’t been a money pit.  I’d assume a purchase price in the $20-30+ K range paying for a good, no stories car.

Thoughts?  Advice? Experience?

TIA

 

Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter)
Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/11/21 10:24 a.m.
nderwater said:

My in-laws have an XK8 vert. It's a softly sprung boat made for cruising the country club and gliding down the interstate. Zero desire to own one after my first drive. The XK that followed it was a whole different animal.

You mean no interest in the X100, but you like the X150?  What was it you didn't like about the driving experience, and what do you like about the later one?  

Tyler H (Forum Supporter)
Tyler H (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand UberDork
10/11/21 11:50 a.m.

It looks like a big Miata in a tuxedo print t-shirt.  I like it!

Pete. (l33t FS)
Pete. (l33t FS) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/11/21 12:23 p.m.

In reply to Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) :

while having the benefit of a lot of cheaper, easily available Ford parts.

The last time I tried to order parts for a late model Jag, the Jaguar dealer said "Those cars are not us anymore. Jaguar is no longer the company that sold those cars.  We do not have anything for them."

The Ford dealer did all but hang up when I provided a Jag VIN.  I cross referenced which model Ford might have the correct part, looked up an eBay listing for one of those cars, and used its VIN to order parts...

fatallightning
fatallightning Reader
10/11/21 12:24 p.m.

I had an X100 XKR for about a year. I've always loved the styling, and I'm relatively young (38) for the typical Jag owner IME. It was torquey, GT, land yacht. I had a vert. Very pronounced cowl shake. J gate transmission was sort on engaging. The trannies in the 8s vs the Rs are notoriously unreliable. My year R got the Merc 5 speed. My 01 was a transitional year with the 2nd gen, but still not fool proof tensioners. That was Rev 3. Trunk is cavernous, back seat a joke. Seatbacks to the rear seat cushions kind of joke. Definitely a floaty girl with overboosted steering. I was going to do the Adamesh rear mufflers and a pulley just because. Same wheel bolt pattern as full size Chevys. Brembo optional brakes and 20s on the special edition. Seats have very little lateral support, wheel is too large a diameter and too thin a rim. Nice GT car like I said. I did some front end suspension rebuild things on mine, coils and plugs, valve cover gaskets, mine broke a stupid little coolant fitting right on the front of the intake manifold. Underhood temps get up there, and things are packed in there. The power tops are notorious for blowing the hydraulic lines that operate them. That usually results in green hydraulic fluid showering out of the center overhead courtesy lights. I'd only use the top with the car keyed on, but not running. Some people will run resistors to lower the voltage to the pump to try and minimize the pressure spiking. 

fatallightning
fatallightning Reader
10/11/21 12:27 p.m.

Mine. 

Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter)
Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) MegaDork
10/11/21 12:40 p.m.

In reply to fatallightning :

tell me more

 

CJ (FS)
CJ (FS) GRM+ Memberand Dork
10/11/21 12:50 p.m.

Obviously took styling cues from the XKE.  Probably would have bought one if they had stolen a few more, but as it is, it kind of looks like a failed tribute car.

iansane
iansane HalfDork
10/11/21 1:15 p.m.
Pete. (l33t FS) said:

In reply to Adrian_Thompson (Forum Supporter) :

while having the benefit of a lot of cheaper, easily available Ford parts.

The last time I tried to order parts for a late model Jag, the Jaguar dealer said "Those cars are not us anymore. Jaguar is no longer the company that sold those cars.  We do not have anything for them."

That happened recently to me. I stopped by the local Jag dealer to see if they could program the parking brake module. "Oh sorry, we don't work on cars older than '08."

Wut.

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