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DoninMedford
DoninMedford New Reader
2/22/22 1:02 p.m.
dean1484 said:

To me that is a $500 car. There is also more pieces missing than just the hood. I see at least part of a fender flair missing as well. 
 

The history of the car means nothing to me.  Should It?  Does the history of this car add value?  

Nope you are right. If you don't care about vintage racing, or the cars history keep your $500 in your pocket as its probably over your head to return a project like this to the track anyway. You have obviously not built or put time into developing a successful race car, the parts that are there alone would cost more than the asking price. The body kit from King Motorsports is about 1.5k shipped so figure on 1/2 that for the rear fenders if you cant repair them. Other people who do care about those things and are more savvy with a wench may find interest in it. Its not mine, so either way is fine but I am a big fan of the car and hope someone saves it. 

AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter)
AngryCorvair (Forum Supporter) GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/22/22 1:09 p.m.
dean1484 said:

To me that is a $500 car. There is also more pieces missing than just the hood. I see at least part of a fender flair missing as well. 
 

The history of the car means nothing to me.  Should It?  Does the history of this car add value?  

certainly no more than it would to, say, a LeMans-winning GT40...

DoninMedford
DoninMedford New Reader
2/22/22 1:18 p.m.

I think the car would be suited to vintage very well.  There are already a few racing in the USA under vintage. The flares are close enough to the 1975/1976 Mugen design that they are "period" correct.  I found a lot of early documentation on this for my Civic if someone does save it and is interested. 

alfadriver
alfadriver GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/22/22 1:20 p.m.

Interesting twist to this thread (was expecting another canoe)....

Something like 15 years ago, there was a rusty shell of an Alfa GT jr for sale for $5000.  Just because it ran in a TA race, and then in some BS races.  No engine, missing a lot of parts, and at the exact same time I was GIVEN a shell that was a street car which was in better condition.  So $5000 was a relative mint.

Maybe the shell will be worth more to someone.  But that would have to be a specific person that has access to make up the rest of the parts.

DoninMedford
DoninMedford New Reader
2/22/22 1:30 p.m.
alfadriver said:

Interesting twist to this thread (was expecting another canoe)....

Something like 15 years ago, there was a rusty shell of an Alfa GT jr for sale for $5000.  Just because it ran in a TA race, and then in some BS races.  No engine, missing a lot of parts, and at the exact same time I was GIVEN a shell that was a street car which was in better condition.  So $5000 was a relative mint.

Maybe the shell will be worth more to someone.  But that would have to be a specific person that has access to make up the rest of the parts.

The Adam Malley's car sold for 28K in 2006 with the powertrain installed, so to someone it had value. The missing parts for a start are not hard to find on the west coast at all thousands of the little cars where driven into fields and under trees and left.  A basic setup would not come close to the 2006 price. Yes history is important. The 5K alfa could have been rebuilt and enjoyed and run in Vintage TA if the history was provable, a lot of people don't grasp this, that is OK. Vintage racing is very popular on the west coast. Not sure how its doing in the rest of the country. 

dean1484
dean1484 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/23/22 12:30 a.m.

What is the cut off date for vintage racing these days?  
 

EDIT. Looks like SCCA is still at 1972?  But you can back date 1973 cars?    I did see another organization that is up to 1989. 

racerfink
racerfink UltraDork
2/23/22 1:15 a.m.

SCCA vintage is up to '85, or there-abouts now.

alfadriver
alfadriver GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/23/22 7:36 a.m.

In reply to DoninMedford :

The Alfa didn't win anything, and was such a rusty mess that it would have taken a TON of money to put it back together.  If it were any of the GTA's that won, or the GTV's that won- it would be a different story.  And since vintage racing allows for street car conversions- it would be considerably cheaper to build a chassis to vintage race than it would be to build that rusty chassis.   And looking at current values, yea....  

The market for people who see real value in just a chassis that they may have saw in the past is pretty small.  It exists, but there are more people who just want to race.

alfadriver
alfadriver GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/23/22 7:38 a.m.
dean1484 said:

What is the cut off date for vintage racing these days?  
 

EDIT. Looks like SCCA is still at 1972?  But you can back date 1973 cars?    I did see another organization that is up to 1989. 

From what I have looked into, yes.  Including a late 70's MG, Triumph,  or Alfa Spider.

Now that more organizations have updated into the 80s, though...  

Type Q
Type Q SuperDork
2/23/22 8:12 a.m.

I went to the SCCA runoffs in '96  as a spectator.  I remember watching that car race.

 

I also met Tim Suddard for the first time that weekend. 

DoninMedford
DoninMedford New Reader
2/23/22 8:40 a.m.

In reply to dean1484 :

You need to do more research. Most of the time its 25 years.  SCCA Vintage, SVRA, VSDA all have a place for this car. 

At PIR they are even letting Miata's and MR2's run in Vintage. 

https://www.oregonscca.com/uploads/8/5/9/0/85902804/vintage2021_final.pdf

 

DoninMedford
DoninMedford New Reader
2/23/22 8:57 a.m.

Marc Frost runs his in the upper midwest for the last few years. They made him remove the front air dam, but I would have protested that because the cars originaly did run with one. Next year he said he just has to comply with 1980s gt5 rules. So air dams are fine

 

 

 

dean1484
dean1484 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/23/22 5:30 p.m.
DoninMedford said:
dean1484 said:

To me that is a $500 car. There is also more pieces missing than just the hood. I see at least part of a fender flair missing as well. 
 

The history of the car means nothing to me.  Should It?  Does the history of this car add value?  

Nope you are right. If you don't care about vintage racing, or the cars history keep your $500 in your pocket as its probably over your head to return a project like this to the track anyway. You have obviously not built or put time into developing a successful race car, the parts that are there alone would cost more than the asking price. The body kit from King Motorsports is about 1.5k shipped so figure on 1/2 that for the rear fenders if you cant repair them. Other people who do care about those things and are more savvy with a wench may find interest in it. Its not mine, so either way is fine but I am a big fan of the car and hope someone saves it. 

You are making some rather interesting assumptions about what I have and have not done with respect to repairing/restoring race cars over the last 30 plus years. 

dean1484
dean1484 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
2/23/22 5:35 p.m.
DoninMedford said:

In reply to dean1484 :

You need to do more research. Most of the time its 25 years.  SCCA Vintage, SVRA, VSDA all have a place for this car. 

At PIR they are even letting Miata's and MR2's run in Vintage. 

https://www.oregonscca.com/uploads/8/5/9/0/85902804/vintage2021_final.pdf

 

Umm. No I do not. I don't care at the moment what it is. But for someone that may be interested in that car they should do the homework if the intent is vintage. Also in case you missed it I did mention I found another vintage organization that is up to 1989. 

DoninMedford
DoninMedford New Reader
2/23/22 6:03 p.m.
dean1484 said:
DoninMedford said:
dean1484 said:

To me that is a $500 car. There is also more pieces missing than just the hood. I see at least part of a fender flair missing as well. 
 

The history of the car means nothing to me.  Should It?  Does the history of this car add value?  

Nope you are right. If you don't care about vintage racing, or the cars history keep your $500 in your pocket as its probably over your head to return a project like this to the track anyway. You have obviously not built or put time into developing a successful race car, the parts that are there alone would cost more than the asking price. The body kit from King Motorsports is about 1.5k shipped so figure on 1/2 that for the rear fenders if you cant repair them. Other people who do care about those things and are more savvy with a wench may find interest in it. Its not mine, so either way is fine but I am a big fan of the car and hope someone saves it. 

You are making some rather interesting assumptions about what I have and have not done with respect to repairing/restoring race cars over the last 30 plus years. 

Well if you post like a moron, most people will assume you are. Enough said about that.  Try making more informed posts next time if you want people to think you know what you are talking about. 

 

Appleseed
Appleseed MegaDork
2/23/22 10:01 p.m.

In reply to DoninMedford :

Man, these posts come off as...combative. Why such a push for a car you aren't associated with?

AClockworkGarage
AClockworkGarage Dork
2/23/22 10:33 p.m.
ValuePack said:

I'm such a sucker for a good rising sun paint job.

I dunno. It's kind of the equivalent of putting a swastika on a Volkswagen.

dculberson
dculberson MegaDork
2/23/22 11:09 p.m.

In reply to DoninMedford :

Enough name calling. You're new here, I get it. You don't know that we don't call people morons even if we think it. Dean is a respected member of the community. Think what you like but keep your communications kind and diplomatic. You can disagree without insulting. 

DoninMedford
DoninMedford New Reader
10/16/22 5:45 p.m.

In reply to dculberson :

Ok you can say it quietly, but I tend to say things as I see them. The car sold in BC for $4,000 as a roller that had not run for 15 years.  The "$500 car" comment from dean1484 was moronic, and came from someone who obviously doesn't build race cars or they would have a better idea of the costs involved.  The panasport wheels would sell for more than that just by themselves. As they are 4x120 and very hard to come by now. I had no involvement in the sale, other than giving the previous owner a few tips. I am very happy to see it go to a good home, that may give it some care and return it to the track in BC one day. 

dean1484
dean1484 GRM+ Memberand MegaDork
10/17/22 8:41 a.m.

You Just can not get over that I still think it is a $500 car.  Once again you have no clue as to what I have built or raced.  I find it sad that because I don't agree with your assessment you  immediately jump to calling me names.  
 

It reminds me of the people that say " if you are not with us you are against us" . This justification is then used to assault those that are not declaring there allegiance to the cause.  Among other things this is what a very bad man used to start WWII.  

I am happy your friend got good $$$ for it and it will hopfully live on.  If it is worth 4K to the person that purchased it then great. I am betting this will be a car that becomes more famous just because of its paint job then what it actually accomplished as a race car.  Winning SCCA titles is just not justification to inflate the price of a car.  The exception to this is if the builder or driver has gone on to win in a professional series title.  Then yes you can add value as it is a part of history associated with a famous driver or builder.  
 

I have never seen this car before this thread and as such I have no emotions attached to it  I see it as a cool car that has been stripped of the driveline requiring a boat load or work to pass tech.  To do that car properly you could be in it for another 10-15k.  I don't see that as being a sound investment.  As a labor of love I get it.  I have restored cars for people due to emotional attachment that made no financial sense to do so.  I can see this car being one of those cars.  Again I can see the paint job being the driving force of nostalgia that will drive this cars restoration and that is really cool and will hopefully then allow this car to live on for many years to come.  
 

Congratulations on the sale!!!

 

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